1.《闯入者》是文化健忘的一幅肖像,尤其是对中国社会的特殊的一代。你认为处在不同时代的人们对于中国的历史中的文化和政治事实的态度有什么区别?
1a.《闯入者》的英文片名Red Amnesia就是一个点题的作用,就是红色健忘。中国被外界普遍认为一个红色的革命的国家,而整个社会目前所发生的巨大的变化,又使人产生了一些根本上的疑惑。目前的中国和它几十年前的样子有哪些变化,又有那些没有变?面对这些问题,整个社会对过去是选择屏蔽和忘记,所以也造成了我们大部分人在现实中容易忽略整个中国社会的历史和变化。
在电影主人公老邓这一代人的青年时代,他们的个人和家庭都处在一个政治化的社会形态里,所以他们是有意识或无意识地在这样的环境里成长,而且是“去自我意识”。那么,等到社会变化以后,他们如何审视和认定自己在那个历史阶段中的生活,和他们个人的态度,就是一个很大的问题。而在青年一代,在一个提倡对过去遗忘、只重视现实和物质的时代,究竟社会的历史和政治的影响对他们有多大,这也是一个值得研究的问题。
Red Amnesia, as the name suggests, is the ‘culture amnesia about the red revolution’. China is widely regarded as a red country. But great changes in current society also fundamentally confuse people. What are the differences between the China a few decades ago and now? And what remains the same? For these questions in history, the whole community chooses to ignore and forget, which leads to most of us neglect history and changes of this society.
In Red Amnesia, the main character Laodeng and her contemporaries grew up in such a politicalized environment, whether they are aware of it or not. They even have a common personality called ‘Relief ego-consciousness’. So when the society changes, how they review and define their life and personal attitude in that specific historical stage becomes a serious problem for them. It’s also worth studying how the history and politics affect their next generation, since they were in the era that encourages people to forget the past and pay all attention to the reality and substance.
2.老邓的一代面临的主要困境和问题是什么?是她的儿子们吗?他们这一代共同面对这些困境和问题的办法是什么?
2a.老邓这一代人经历了从1949年到现在的整个社会进程。在80年代以前,他们的青春期和中年期是经历了和现在完全不同的一个社会形态、政治形态。他们的主要困境就是当这一切改变,进入老年生活以后,他们年轻时经历的一切所形成的世界观、政治观该如何面对。而他们自我意识的缺失,在新的社会环境里、在强调自我和个性的环境里他们遇到了巨大的冲击。由这个冲击造成的人性的性格撕裂是他们这代中国人里非常独一无二典型的人格特征。至于他的孩子们和其他的问题,那只是一个外部的在社会形态里需要处理的一个问题,根本的处境是他们自身怎么调整和面对巨大的社会变化和反差。
Laodeng’s generation experiences the whole social processes from 1949 till now. Before the 1980s, the social and political environment was totally different. Those ideas formed in their adolescence and middle age meet a completely different situation in their senior. So their key issue is how to face the whole world when it has been shaped otherwise. Their lack of ego-consciousness also meets a new society, the one emphasizes ego and individuality. It’s a unique personality of this generation. As for other issues such as their offspring, they are just some external problems to be handled. The key issue is still how to adjust themselves and face the great contrast of society.
3.你认为电影自身就是一个立足于生活/解决现实问题的途径吗?
3a.我认为电影立足于生活和提出问题,是比较常见和根本的。但是能不能解决现实问题也是一个疑问。但是我觉得解决问题的方式可以是开放的,比如《闯入者》里面的老邓是从一个一直被遮蔽的人到最后发现、打开去面对,但是在她发现以后能不能解决这个问题,电影还是留下一个巨大的问号。但这也是在电影中需要更多提出的一个反思,就是说我们是不是作为个体在社会中就只是政治受害者的一个身份,有没有从自身上找出一些问题,比如自己可能是被裹挟也好,有自我意识或没有,但实际却是某些事实和现实的实施者和推动者。这个问题基于老邓,可能是对她过去的一个提问,但同时引申过来,我们现在处在中国目前的这个社会,我们是不是也和老邓一样,处在某种被裹挟的状态?这是不是给我们的一种提醒?我们需要更清醒的意识和社会问题相处?个人的意识和集体需要你扮演的角色是什么样的?可能这个问题也是对未来起作用的。
It’s common and fundamental that cinema raises questions based on the reality. But it’s hard to say whether it can answer them. The problems can be coped in many ways. Take Laodeng in Red Amnesia as example, she hides at first, and then gradually confronts and responds. But yet Red Amnesia doesn’t tell the audience whether she solves the problems in the end. It’s a reflection in Red Amnesia – are individuals just the victims of politics? Or shall we dig into ourselves? In fact, we may find out that we are enforcers of some reality and social events to some extents. Are we involved into the similar situation as Laodeng in the present China? Is this film a reminder? How can we cope social problems more clearly? What kind of role the community and yourself demands you to play? These questions will always have values.
4.主角对她年幼的儿子的性取向的刻意的忽视是影片一个张力的来源。你能评价一下在当下的中国同性恋是怎么被看待和接近的吗?这是另一个代沟的表现吗?
4a.它代表的是一个弱小的个体,像女主这样的个体,她在前半生想要努力改变什么,最后其实不见得能由她自己的意愿所决定,所以她的潜意识里是一个自卑的失败者,她不可能改变什么,她是强大的社会机器里很小的一部分。她的回避和忽视可能就是意识到自己的弱小。所以这种忽视恰恰影射出一个弱小的个体在社会机制中的微不足道。至于同性恋被看待,我觉得是随着这个社会和整个国际的信息的交流中,已经有更多的知识和信息被传递到每一个个体里,所以如何看待这个问题每个人都有不同的态度,至少现在不是死板一块,在慢慢的松动。
Laodeng represents a vulnerable individual. She spent her early years try to make great changes, but it turns out that things don’t bend to her will. She is actually a tiny part of the social machine. Her avoidance comes from realizing her weakness. As for how the homosexuality are treated, everyone’s attitude is different and changing, along with knowledge and information infiltrating through the international communication.
5.《闯入者》中有一些对空的场地的跟踪拍摄的视觉主题。这些镜头意味着什么?地理上的空间?一种缺席?还是一种记忆?
5a.对空的场地的拍摄都是一些实景拍摄。从某种意义上会让观众产生错觉认为这些镜头都是一些闪回,一些古老的镜头发生在过去的事情,但是电影到最后,观众才意识到它就存在于现在。老邓在现实中走进这些场景告诉观众它们是现实存在的,有一些穿越的感觉。所以人的成长和性格的产生其实都是离不开过去的。这些镜头我觉得就意味着一种贯穿,不管是地理上的还是时间上的,从记忆中贯穿到现在。所以你想要抹去或者你以为抹去了,你以为把它们荒芜在那里它就不存在了吗?我觉得这是《闯入者》里比较清晰地提问。
We shoot on locations of those empty spaces. Somehow these shots give audience an illusion that they are flashbacks or old shots of the past. But at the end of the film, the audience realizes the shots represents the present. I want to signify the existence of these places by Laodeng coming back in place as well as in time. People are the outcome of their past. I consider these shots as an inheritance of memory, time and space. Things leave tracks behind regardless of how hard people manage to wipe them out. That’s clearly referred to in Red Amnesia.
6.你能不能谈一谈《闯入者》在你的“文革三部曲”中的意义?还有这部和其他几部的关系?
6a.《闯入者》在“生命三部曲”或“三线三部曲”是一个延续篇,前面的《我11》背景是1975年文革结束前后,《青红》应该发展到1982、1983左右,80年代真正要开始改革开放的时期,《闯入者》是讲现在,所以这三部连到一起有一个时间线,有历史的纵贯性 。因为从文革开始,一直到现在,通过三部影片来讲述历史对人的影响,所以任何一个历史事件,可能在这一代人彻底结束之前,甚至换了新一代人可能依然会有影响,这就是我们要小心的面对我们的社会、面对我们的现实、小心的处理我们的历史事件的一个根本原因。比如三线这个历史事件它造成的影响就在老邓身上、老邓后代的身上、甚至找她复仇的第三代小孩子的身上,都会留下痕迹。
Red Amnesia is a continuation of the Life Trilogy or the Third front Trilogy. 11 Flowers sets back in 1975 around the end of the Cultural Revolution. Shanghai Dreams focuses on the period of 1982 to 1983 when China was about to carry out the Reform and Opening-up Policy. Red Amnesia talks about the present. The trilogy is consecutive in time period and history events. The effect of historical events on people is also consecutive from generation to generation, just like what happens to Laodeng, her offspring and the little boy who seeks vengeance. That’s why we need to be cautious when facing the reality and handling the historical events.
7.未来有什么新的项目和规划?
7a.未来的项目还在规划中。结束了三线三部,我觉得还是有必要把注意力投放在当下的社会里。其实当下的社会所发生的变化、所产生的影响同样是来自于过去的影响,同时也会影响未来的走向。对于现实发生的事情也要有个更清醒的看法,我希望新的项目还是关注现实。
I am still planning further projects. Upon closure of the trilogy, I find it necessary to focus on the present society. But note that changes and developments we have today are still under the influence of the past, while being an impact on the future themselves. We should have a clear mind about the present, and so does my new project.